If you make minimum wage, you have to work a lot of hours to afford a two-bedroom apartment, according to a study from the National Low Income Housing Coalition using data from the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development.
Last night, Ed showed the NLIHC's excellent chart during a segment on the GOP war on the working poor.
It shows how many hours you have to work per week in each state to earn rent for a two bedroom apartment.
In Texas, it's 88 hours. In Florida, it's 97 hours. In Virginia, it's 112 hours, on and on.
All this makes us long for the return of Jimmy McMillan, a former candidate for governor of New York for the Rent Is Too Damn High Party.
While the problem is not funny, of course, his sense of humor certainly brought much-needed attention to the problem:
First came the debate, then the appearance on The Last Word, then the spoof on Saturday Night Live. Now, New York gubernatorial candidate Jimmy "Rent is Too High" McMillan returns to the show.
How many minimum wage hours does it take to afford a two-bedroom apartment in your state?
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Goes right along with a college student starting out $141,000 in debt.
And Republicans want to lower minimum wage!
No they don't Chris. They want to eliminate it. Along with worker safety regulations and child labor laws. Bachmann talked about all 3 on the house floor.
Ok, I'll bite. Assuming you two are serious. If you aren't serious, then I appreciate your humor and just skip answering and we can move on to other topics.
How much should the minimum wage be to pay the rent, buy Obamacare and pay for the $141,000 in student debt?
Was anybody else there? Or was she just talking to herself?
Rusty-
Maybe you should ask the Republicans that. It's their ideas.
Naw- doubt you can find a Republican who thinks that the minimum wage should be significant to do what you inferred.
If you were just being silly and nonsensical on your original post, I can understand that. I only responded because I thought you might be serious- and that could lead to a real discussion.
Why do we need a 'real discussion'? You would like to see the minimum wage eliminated just like the rest of the self serving teabaggers.
OK- let's see, then. You must want it increased to $1000 an hour just like the rest of the free loaders.
There- now we've both made a stupid accusation. Tex- I think I'm getting the hang of having a discussion with you.
Then answer the accusation. Do you, or do you not think it's wrong for businesses to be required to pay a minimum wage? Judging by your drama queen statement that ' How much should the minimum wage be to pay the rent, buy insurance and pay for the $141,000 student debt'? leads me to believe you think it's wrong. Am I incorrect?
Doesn't matter what I think. It is the law, and must be followed. And- it seems as if there are those who are in favor of changing the law to increase it. Unless a bill is proposed to eliminate it, then your statement is moot. Now when there is a bill to increase it, the discussion needs to center around how much it should be.
The actual context here, though, is that Chris doesn't think it is possible to pay off $141k in student loans when earning the minimum wage. Heck- I would agree with that.
So it begs the question- with the parameters Chris has set- what do you all think the minimum wage should be? Now to be fair- whatever number you give, if it is an increase, my next question is going to be if you think an increase in costs is going to reduce the job openings?
The cost of a rental in AL is an average of $ 1,000 per month. Insane!!
A 1 bdrm apt. in Albany OR is around $600/mo. There's a 3 bdrm house on my block for rent at $1300/mo.
Albany OR,,, Portland here.
Here in Central Illinois- I've even heard of $3000 a month rent. It was for a short term lease that an executive of a local company was renting before moving his family down- just thought I would toss it in as just as relevant as the above...
kinda insane to live in al anyway
According to the chart above, 77 hours...
I am currently paying $450 a month for half of a duplex, which, at a minimum of $7.25, comes to just over 62 hours...
Guess I got a good deal...
For now.
Well, you have to consider, the area I live in is economically depressed... The tourism up here, usually good in Winter from snowmobiling and cross-country skiing, was badly hit from the lack of snowfall, about a foot for the entire season...
Although Sault Ste. Marie, MI, is economically a suburb of Sault Ste. Marie, Canada, the requirement for passports to cross the border and the legal restrictions against a US citizen working and earning a living in Canada ensures the American side stays the poorer community...
Wait just a second... I just reread the story...
I thought these rents were 'per MONTH', but the numbers of hours are 'rent per WEEK'...
OMG! 77 * $7.25 = $558.25 per WEEK?! $2250 per MONTH!? For a two-bedroom APARTMENT??!! $26, 800 a YEAR???!!!
I am living on $1650 a MONTH!
There is something SERIOUSLY wrong with those numbers...
"It shows how many hours you have to work per week in each state to earn rent for a two bedroom apartment."
Most people work a 40-hour work week...
According to this chart, a 2-bedroom apartment requires a minimum-wage worker to work 20 hours a day, no weekends, on average, just for rent...
That rent IS too damn high...
Naaah. That's good enough for the middle-class and the poor.
What do they think they are? Rich?
Everything cost to damn much! I can remember setting in 5th grade class and we were talking how horrible it was there were bread lines in Russia, eggs a dollar a dozen. Spring forward what seems a life time ago and here we are. Soup kitchens, bread out of site and eggs cost arm and leg. Products in the store really have me upset. Make it smaller and charge more. We bought our home before the bubble existed. Thank God or we could not afford it now. People in this country work there fingers to the bone for money to give to some else. How in the hell can you get ahead ? The workers in America are working each day and getting closer to the poor house. There is a great song by Tennessee Ernie Ford, I just remember few of the lines. "Another day older and deeper in debt, St. Peter don't you call me because I can't go I owe my soul to the company store. " Pretty much says it all!
Pam
That does paint the true picture alright. I must be getting old, I remember that song.
I also remember in the 5th grade talking to the school bus driver, yeh, we had school buses, and one thing he said stands out very clear today. "This country will never be taken from the outside, but will be taken over from within". Look around.
Sixteen Tons...
Some people say a man is made outta mud
A poor man's made outta muscle and blood
Muscle and blood and skin and bones
A mind that's a-weak and a back that's strong
You load sixteen tons, what do you get
Another day older and deeper in debt
Saint Peter don't you call me 'cause I can't go
I owe my soul to the company store
I was born one mornin' when the sun didn't shine
I picked up my shovel and I walked to the mine
I loaded sixteen tons of number nine coal
And the straw boss said "Well, a-bless my soul"
You load sixteen tons, what do you get
Another day older and deeper in debt
Saint Peter don't you call me 'cause I can't go
I owe my soul to the company store
I was born one mornin', it was drizzlin' rain
Fightin' and trouble are my middle name
I was raised in the canebrake by an ol' mama lion
Cain't no-a high-toned woman make me walk the line
You load sixteen tons, what do you get
Another day older and deeper in debt
Saint Peter don't you call me 'cause I can't go
I owe my soul to the company store
If you see me comin', better step aside
A lotta men didn't, a lotta men died
One fist of iron, the other of steel
If the right one don't a-get you
Then the left one will
You load sixteen tons, what do you get
Another day older and deeper in debt
Saint Peter don't you call me 'cause I can't go
I owe my soul to the company store
Good ole Johnny Cash...........
yep- Johnny Cash and Bob Hope- both gone. Outa Cash and Outa Hope. Obama's campaign theme this year.
David..... Merle Travis wrote Sixteen Tons, but it was made a hit by Ford.
Levon Helms the drummer of "The Band" just passed away April 19, 2012 as well. He was the main person in the band and the only American I believe. The other members were Canadians. They broke up during the 70's but there music lives on.
Johnny Cash.... "Hurt" was one of his last recordings if not his last. Beyond me.
Six...
I never said Tennessee wrote "16 Tons"... In fact, I didn't say WHO wrote it, did I?
"Sixteen Tons" is a song about the life of a coal miner, first recorded in 1946 by American country singer Merle Travis and released on his box set album Folk Songs of the Hills the following year. A 1955 version recorded by Tennessee Ernie Ford reached number one in the Billboard charts, while another version by Frankie Laine was released only in the United Kingdom, where it gave Ford's version competition.
Yes.... I remember when gas was 20 cents a gallon and they would have what they called gas wars and it would drop down to 17 cents a gallon. Heck the Federal Tax on gas is 18.4 cents now. The state tax ranges from 8 cents a gallon in Alaska to 49.6 cents a gallon in Connecticut. California may be higher now. This was July 1, 2011.
# Bedrooms
Mar
Feb
Jan
3 Month %
change
Studio
N/A
N/A
N/A
0%
1 Bed
$744
$821
$715
4.1%
2 Bed
$828
$1,010
$842
-1.7%
3 Bed
$1,118
$1,191
$1,225
-8.7%
Congratulations. You've finally blown a gasket. NO ONE knows what the hell you're talking about.
Are you renting out rooms?
Are you speaking for everyone Real or just yourself?
Back at you. I got a vote. How about you?
Time ran out and mouse disappeared. If you can believe this:
Oil company profits.
http://www.dailymarkets.com/economy/2011/04/27/gasoline-taxes-vs-exxon-profit-per-gallon/
http://mediamatters.org/blog/201105120029
I do know one thing for sure. If you're in the market for a home and if you don't own one maybe you should be in the market for buying one, let's hope there will be no better time than right now to purchase it.
Great advice. In fact, the story came out about a month ago that Warren Buffett's secretary was actually buying a 2nd home to vacation in- I believe in the Vegas area. The story was that he advised her it was a good time to pick up a 2nd home.
The link that was suppose to be on #5 is this one I believe. I didn't save it in time with the different posting, so you got the other garbage.
Link for #5: http://www.commonsensejunction.com/notes/gas-tax-rate.html
Ed, The last time I had a minimum wage job was when I was 16. At 17 I was earning nearly twice the minimum wage. But I lived at home and didn't need an apartment. At 18 I moved out on my own and never had a problem earning more than minimum wage.
You would have to be an idiot to believe you could support ypourself or any one else on a minimum wage, I don't think it was ever intended to do so. Do you have any statistics on the age of people working for minimum wage? I am curious if the majority are kids.
Ed, I did a check and found the US Department of Labor does have statistics. They report there are about 75,000 people receiving minimum wage or less. A little over 5,000 are between 16 and 19 years old. A total of 15K are 25 or younger. They provided data on groups of ages 25 to 34, 35 to 44, 45 to 54, etc... Each of these groups has about 15K in it until you get to the 55 to 64 group when the number drops significantly.
I guess my question would be why are people over 18 still working minimum wage jobs? Why haven't they progressed in the labor market?
I found that 11K did not graduate High School and 27K only had a High School education. That makes up over half the total number of people earning minimum wage or less. I was surprised to see a little over 11K has BA Degrees or higher.
I can only conclude that these people lack either the ability or the drive to get better paying jobs, especially those with higher education.
I remember watching a program about Walmart employees demanding more pay and benefits. One employee really shuck in my head. He was 33 years old, had worked for Walmart for 3 years and was earning $10.00 an hour. I asked myself at the time what the hell was this guy doing from the ages 18 to 30 that he found himself working at Walmart at 33. Ever since High School I moved from job to job, always earning more money and getting better benefits. The last five years I worked I took a job 193 miles from my home for better pay and benefits. I had a home with a mortgage and rented an apartment near my work. The gas driving back and forth on the weekends was killer, but the wage was worth it.
Bottom line if people are not content with their wage they need to take the responsbility for improving themselves and making themselves more valuable to an employer. Relying on the Government is not a path to success.
Not everyone is born with the same capabilities. I suspect that had the US (like many European countries) invested as much in technical and applied arts schooling as we have in academics, many of our people would have been qualified for higher paying work.
Don't forget that business spends a lot of money lobbying to keep wages down, and has shipped millions of factory jobs off shore.
"Characteristics of MinimumWage Workers: 2011
In 2011, 73.9 million American workers age 16 and over were paid at hourly rates, representing 59.1 percent of all wage and salary workers.1 Among those paid by the hour, 1.7 million earned exactly the prevailing Federal minimum wage of $7.25 per hour. About 2.2 million had wages below the minimum.2 Together, these 3.8 million workers with wages at or below the Federal minimum made up 5.2 percent of all hourly-paid workers. Tables 1 through 10 present data on a wide array of demographic and socioeconomic characteristics for hourly-paid workers earning at or below the Federal minimum wage. The following are some highlights from the 2011 data. ...",
Is there a mix-up in percentages and thousands?
Oops, linkie
There aren't enough higher paying jobs to go around. Many folks have to work two or more jobs to support their families!
4.4 million work min wage, or 6%. Avg. age is 16 to 24. Avg. wages are $15,080 per year. Most states acknowledge the federal minimum wage laws except states in the southeast. Some states pay a higher rate, some pay less.
And why have they not progressed in the labor market? Because wages have become stagnant over the past 30 yrs compaired to corporate profits. Not to mention all the manufacturing jobs that have been sent overseas for higher profits.
John, Where did you get the data specifically the 4.4 million?
Yahoo News Feb 2, 2012
'Who works for minimum wage'
John, Never mind, I think we are looking at the same data, I errored in reading the tables, ie (in thousands). Thanks any way.
NP 2ez
It just another way this Trickle Down Crap has played a Joke on the American Public, While these Millionaires are Stuffing their Pockets off your Labor. paid Little or no Taxes, While Suppressing Wages for Years, Your Pay hasn't kept up with the Rising Costs of Utilities, Rents, Food, Cable, Gas Pump Etc. the American Public Should be tired of these( Mitt GOP) Clowns and their Warped Plans. Just Say no to the GOP this Nov!!
real chris , states can raise the minimum as high as they want to. only requirment is it be at or higher than the federal minimum wage. so calif ny mass and other liberal states can raise it to $20.00 an hour if they wish. whats stopping them? so its silly to gripe about the federal minimun wage.
This is crazy how are wee suppose to feed our familys pay electric gas our cars and buy food when the moneys going straight to rent? and the sad part is they don't even care!
Obviously VP Biden cares deeply since he is giving so much to charity and he is making extra tax payments to the government in order to help.
For 5 years, I had 3 jobs, working 86 hours per week and was living in a studio apartment for $800 per month plus utilities in Norwalk, CT. I finally moved out of the area.
I agree with a minimum wage. Any civilized country should have this.
I also think that if you cannot afford to live in an area you should move to a different area. It may not be easy or pleasant, and yes, you may have to go from a good, comfortable, fun job to one that sucks. You may have to move away from friends you have known your whole life, maybe even family.
BUT if you cannot afford to live in Manhattan then do not live in Manhattan. America is a very large country.
You know what kind of person believes that if you don't like your lot in life, you should have tried harder? Someone that has nothing to worry about, and likely never has. If you have never known hard times, or if you don't know them now, then other people's hard times are irrelevant to yourself, right? I don't understand, the same people that bitch about putting taxes for the weathiest back where they used to be at 20-30%, get pissed when you want to increase minimum wage, both saying that we can't afford it and that people are just 'freeloading'. First, what do you mean 'we' can't afford it...when 1% owns 99% of the wealth, 'we' can afford anything 'we' want; second, if you're working, you aren't freeloading...i can see bitching about welfare recipients, but minimum wage earners are not 'freeloaders'...they are doing what some consider low valued work (though i would argue undervalued work...how many service jobs are more difficult that those cushy executive jobs where white male @!$%#s get old fashioned's in their office for six figures?).